Good evening, my sisters and brothers.

(Hall): ‘Good evening, master Zelanus.’

Which of you has the first question?

(Lady in the hall): ‘Master Zelanus, does astrology on the whole have no cosmic meaning?’

No.

But now?

(Lady in the hall): ‘It is because, I was busy reading the Revelation of John; people said that it had a cosmic meaning.’

Revelations of John?

(Lady in the hall): ‘Yes.’

From the bible?

(Lady in the hall): ‘Yes, that will be from the bible, I think.’

I already explained it a hundred times.

We spoke about it recently.

If you take the earth in your hands, and a piece of steel: can that inspire you?

And that’s it.

(Lady in the hall says something.)

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Master Zelanus, I would like to come back to cremation, by means of which the aura is destroyed. What happens to those peoples where the people are cremated without exception?’

The aura is not destroyed.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Oh, I thought that you had said that the last time.’

Yes, the physical aura dissolves, but it is not destroyed.

It is the shock which you experience.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘So all those peoples, where they are all cremated for their religion ...’

They do not know any better.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘And those who are also burned because of an accident ...’

Yes, all the same thing.

Look, you lack the physical aura in that world, because this happens with a shock.

You get, you suck that back later.

But that aura does not dissolve, in the sense that it cannot be used for the spirit.

Now everything goes too fast.

Can you feel this?

And now you must experience that ‘beyond the coffin’.

Read ‘A View into the Hereafter.’

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Yes.’

There you are.

But that is the same thing for all the peoples and every human being.

In the East you have that a lot.

But those people must learn that.

In the East there are so many philosophers, and people have contact; remarkable that these laws cannot be received.

And why not?

The human being is not open.

There are so many philosophers, so many occult people in the East, and these messages do not come through.

On the contrary, the philosophers say that it is ‘hygienic.’

What?

How is that?

Do you see?

So people do not even have direct contact there.

There are hundreds and thousands who are open, millions, to the metaphysical laws, the occult laws, they speak and see, disembody; and they do not know that.

That is the first thing that the human being must receive: do not accept any cremation.

After all, you do not know the laws, for ‘beyond the coffin’, for your body.

What is your state like?

Which aura do you absorb?

So that aura cannot be destroyed, you get that gradually, but you experience that shock spiritually, consciously or unconsciously, that means, the first sphere, or a lower state, you experience that.

And you need that aura of that organism, because the spiritual body builds itself up by means of that.

But you have lower organs here for the organism, and that lower aura serves again for fundamental feeling, power, energy; you need that.

(To the hall): Which of you?

(Lady in the hall): ‘Master Zelanus, may I come back to the question for a moment from that lady, about astrology?’

Yes.

(Lady in the hall): ‘If the moon already has such an influence on the sea, that ebb, and flow, can come, then it is also logical that the stars under which people are born, as they say, also have their influence on us, isn’t it?

And everything which we then do under influence of those stars, is also cosmic, isn’t it?’

That is cosmic.

Look, the moon has the power to heal.

We do not finish that.

You can heal because of the moon.

The moon has power over the life seas.

I explained that one evening.

People did not know it, by what means the water actually reacts for the cosmic core; that is the spirit of the moon, the soul of the moon.

The water reached independence on the moon as soul and spirit and personality.

So the moon can heal you, you can gain strength physically, but the moon cannot give you any feeling.

That is what it is about now.

So you can, even if you look at the moon for a thousand years, then you cannot learn to play the violin, after all.

You do not get wisdom, because you must master that.

And now the academic says, the astrologer says: ‘In that and that time the moon can, and the cosmos can bring you accidents.’

For example, this law: ‘Do not go on a trip, because accidents will happen, you will die.’

Must the moon, who is a mother and is evolution, kill you?

There is no dying.

So you prevent your evolution because of the astrologer.

But you cannot do that, for that matter.

So here you already stand before a deep pit.

So you do not get personality from the macrocosmos, you must master that by means of fatherhood and motherhood, love, life, social consciousness, but you can get healing from the cosmos, so that is physical.

Everything physical, nothing spiritual.

Do you accept that?

This is very simple.

And the astrologer builds further, further, further; finally there is nothing left of that.

If you are sick, in Egypt, and in the East ...

The moon cure, an incredible powerful cure – now you must, you must know that cure – for cancer, tuberculosis, the moon.

That is possible.

But you cannot change those diseases, and ...

Can you feel?

So everything which concerns the personality, the inner life, you must earn that.

Otherwise God is unjust.

Ultimately we have to experience grade after grade, law after law.

How can you get that from a piece of ground, earth, steel?

That steel, and those other planets, they have a material aura, of course, and you can receive that, but it does not bring you to the first sphere.

It is beautiful.

Is it clear?

(Someone in the hall says something.)

Yes?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Yes, master Zelanus.

The longing to experience the material being one, that lives much stronger in one human being than in the other.

I would like to know from you: what is the cause of that, what are the influences and the causes which actually determine that longing?’

That is nature.

If you look at the universe and into nature, then you see that every insect, birds, the human being, the animal, is busy creating and giving birth.

That is the divine source in the human being.

Of course, the human being can experience the lower grades of that.

So when you ... the ...

Now I can bring you into connection with the fourth cosmic grade, and then you will only give birth twice in your seven thousand year long life.

Then that is no longer necessary, because the human being only gives birth there in order to determine reincarnation.

And then you give birth for yourself, you create a child for yourself – the mother – and you cannot even attract more children.

And then the being one stops.

Can you feel this?

Why do you get to see that in nature, the birds, the animals?

That is the divine core, the divine attunement in the human being and in the animal.

And that brings you to material, physical being one in order to give birth and to create.

So you will feel, when you are ‘beyond the coffin’ soon, then you will irrevocably reach spiritual being one, and then that will also dissolve in you.

Why?

Because in the first place you will already have lost the physical driving force.

There are people ...

You now have seven grades of being one.

The animal-like, the pre-animal-like, there are people who experience that spiritually.

You have the physical grades separate.

One human being has the organism for that and the other human being does not.

So you now get the physical state, the state of feeling, the spiritual state, and the state, the feelings of the direct personality.

So now it can be and it is possible that the divine core in you forces you to giving birth and creating, of course.

If that is normal, then you give birth and you create.

And there are mothers who do not have any children, then that is either disharmony, or you are finished.

You no longer come back again.

But that is already a great deal.

That means, there are mothers who give birth to fifteen, twelve, nine children, and would no longer need it either for themselves, but now serve the own grade of life.

Every human being now has the own world, and in that world we meet thousands and thousands of problems, which you have, your wife has, and which you have to do with, but which dissolve ‘beyond the coffin’ for the physical state.

You understand that what you now meet in society, is after all usually material longing.

So when the human being finally gives birth for God and for reincarnation, then you follow the laws of nature.

And then you only give birth once, twice in your life, and then it is over.

Then the source dies and then you pass over into the spiritual personality; and you see that, you experience that, and that becomes spatially deep.

And the physical no longer has meaning.

But the core in the organism is the divine attunement, and that only for giving birth and creation, so for the reincarnation.

Everything which you make of that yourself, is superfluous.

Everything which you also add, you can experience the being one, you will feel, one day you will come out of that material grade.

And then you will miss that struggle for the people, inner struggle, physical struggle, which is over ‘beyond the coffin’, if you are also spiritually free of that.

Or it will be a million times worse.

If you have just one wrong thought in you, and you really still have attunement between the Land of Twilight and the Land of Hatred, then a few hundred people will charge at you in order to take those life juices from you, and then you will become free from those material, physical feelings of your own accord.

People will experience you free from that sphere.

If we had had to write those books, you would no longer have read them.

But it means little.

That whole physical grade, and that physical feeling means little, if you still accept and cling and want to experience one source, and that is: pure love.

And now the physical dissolves into the spiritual, because by means of nature, by means of giving birth and creation you reach the spiritual grade.

They are now the lectures in The Hague.

Now we must build up around the personality, the being one, the giving birth, creation, reincarnation, we must therefore build up a personality for ourselves, outside of that creation.

That is, this is and remains divinely sacred.

This is the most perfect which the human being got, nature, every insect, every little animal, and has divine meaning and is, once more, divinely sacred.

You do not get that in your hands, because you are that.

So you are giving birth, creation.

And if that was not there, if you were to experience that power in your hands, then everything would break.

But that core lives and that is, your whole system determines that, that is your space, your spiritual consciousness, cosmic contact, the divine principle in the human being.

And those systems ...

Science, or mankind, it knows those systems, those organs, but those organs actually have, with everything and because of everything, direct contact with God.

You look at character traits, you look at art, you look at millions of things in society and in life, but fatherhood and motherhood, the organs for that, are the divine senses, the creating, the giving birth powers, directly from God, and every little animal has that.

When you come ‘beyond the coffin’, it is only then that you will understand those organs, as feeling, as personality, as light, as life, as love, as space.

And you will feel, now it is not understood on earth.

Because when are you really one?

If you experience the cosmic unity and you undergo fatherhood and motherhood, and you are both mother, also as a man, then you really get the divine sending out and the accepting, and that rises out above your human consciousness.

And then it becomes increasingly sacred, immaculate, pure.

You could write a book about that again.

Do you understand it?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Thank you.’

(To someone in the hall): Over there.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Master Zelanus, I wanted to ask you: where does the evolution of the winged species begin here on earth?’

Of the winged species?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Yes.’

If you commit a deed tomorrow which gets spatial attunement, you will have feathers for your great wings.

Now, now you can begin with that.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Yes, I am actually not expressing myself well.

I mean ...’

No, but this is it.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘ ... I mean the winged animal species.’

For the animal species?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Yes.’

When the animal is released from ...

Have you not seen any animals who still live in the waters and still fly?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Yes.’

It begins there.

So in the waters, so half-water-like, half-land consciousness, and then gradually winged on the land, and the animal goes into the universe.

But if you want to have that for yourself, then you will feel, then you will give wings to life, the laws, the grades, the problems, everything from God and in the universe.

And then also this: the human being has inner wings.

You rise over all those spaces, you fly through them, by means of the power of your personality.

And the animal has no more than this.

So your tiger and your lion and those other species, they will soon enter the universe and must experience the highest, that is: the winged animal.

Another species of animal was not created there.

Do you mean that?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Yes, master Zelanus.

And then I also wanted to ask you this: there are winged species in the jungle, but there are also winged species here in the West.’

Yes.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Does the evolution of the winged species therefore begin from the jungle to the West?’

From the jungle to the West.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Oh yes.’

So from the animal-like grades to the, the already adjusting for the human being.

Is it clear?

Everything comes from the jungle, because it originated and was born there.

Anything else?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Yes.

And then the animals which are here in the West and still do not belong to the winged species?’

Evolution.

They gradually go higher and let go of their group of life and feeling, and gradually rise.

That takes millions of years.

The human being has a quicker development than the animal.

You know, nature, tree, flower, plant, they all go very fast, that life rise upwards quickly, because there is no sullying, no destruction.

If that life, a flower, was born, then that has already happened, then the growth and the consciousness are already completed.

Also every grade of life, in whatever form, has its own space, time, soul, spirit, personality.

This has natural attunement to the Divine colour spectrum, the flowers.

Anything else?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Yes, master Zelanus.

In the books I read that there are also animals in the astral world which still do not belong to the winged species.

For example, there are fish swimming in ponds.

How is that possible?’

Yes, you have ...

The fish remains a fish.

Can you feel that?

So that fish, those goldfish, and all those species of fish, experience their highest grade.

That is a world group.

That is a group of feeling, with material attunement.

So the fish remains a fish.

The flower remains a flower.

And the animal remains an animal.

And the human being remains a human being.

So you get different existing species as an independence.

Can you feel this?

Otherwise you would not see any flowers, any nature, in the spheres.

But that is there, irrevocably.

And of course, if you go to the fourth cosmic grade, everything is different again; but you still have fish, you still have animals, flowers, trees, people, spaces, plants, light.

Anything else?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘So if I understand it properly, master Zelanus, then the evolution towards the winged species, must take place here on earth?’

That happens here, that must take place here.

So there are animals ...

Your dog and cat, those animals need ten million years in order to be a winged animal, ten million years.

Because, you know, those animal species are still very young, they only began thousands of years ago.

And creation is millions of years old.

So those are already species ...

One and a half million years ago you did not see these species.

And that is all evolution, branches, divisions, you see, from a source.

And that sources branches off by means of different life forms.

And your dog and cat have the time, as a group.

We now call that a group spirit, and a group life, as masses.

Those masses attract each other and continue and keep going until the last animal dissolves.

And gradually, like you as a human being attune your feelings to the divine core, you do something, and then you nibble away so much feeling from your divine attunement, and that changes as a character trait for a higher consciousness.

Isn’t it true?

So that animal gradually enters the winged species by giving birth, and suddenly dissolves, and you see that there and there, there and there.

A dog goes back to the jungle and later becomes one of those wild species.

Can you feel this?

Because that is again, the lowest is now the highest grade for this animal, as grade, as life source.

Is it clear?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Yes, master.

Thank you.’

At your service.

(To the hall): Which of you?

(Lady in the hall): ‘Master Zelanus, seen from your world, do you support the hunger strike?’

That is nonsense.

(Lady in the hall)): ‘So what Gandhi did.’

Was suicide.

(Lady in the hall): ‘But he did actually point out a spiritual purpose.’

He achieved something, but you cannot do that if you ... in harmony..

All those great spirits, Gandhi, and all those others, who did something for their purpose, building up, that is all good, if they do not destroy themselves consciously.

If Gandhi had died during his treatments – we met him – then it was conscious suicide.

Bad?

Yes, that’s it.

And you can find that again with doctors, with geniuses, the technical wonders.

The human being does something, thinks he can achieve something, but for what purpose?

Gandhi had higher feeling.

He wanted to force the human being by means of that.

By means of the good?

Christ would not have done that.

By means of the good?

Christ was more than Gandhi anyway.

Christ ate.

Christ had His daily bread.

He fed himself with some water, some water of life, for months, months, months.

And Gandhi did that too.

But Christ made sure that His body was not destroyed, was not undermined.

Because this is being rebellious, being in disharmony with the laws for the body.

You have to take that into account.

And now you can do good, and now you can do so much, you are in conflict with that body.

If that body passes over five minutes too soon, then you are also in the ground with that body for five minutes and you are attached to that organism, because you have destroyed it.

There are other means to do good.

And then Gandhi should have understood that the world is still not conscious for his deed.

The human being who is burnt at the stake, consciously, the human being who does that and that consciously in order to do something for mankind, he gives his life, is conscious suicide; because Christ did not want it.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘No.’

We had to accept those laws, and this is just.

And if that justice was not there, then you would just live it up, and just do what you want.

You would have no restriction, no halt, you could do and make and break what you want, there is nothing which says: oh yes, but I ...

You got the physical laws in order to make them disappear in that way.

That is in conflict with the cosmos, with the divine creation.

You have the time of life, you have so much time here, years, in order to be here, and now that body demands for your spirit, your divine core, to also be able to experience that time.

And you destroy that in order to reach those and those people, then you have to accept those other laws.

Is it harsh?

That is not harsh, child.

That is not harsh at all, that is reality, justice.

There are so many people who think of doing that and that because of an inner urge.

If an individual attunes himself, why would we not walk through your streets carrying a great deal of advertising, with crosses on our backs, in order to do a bit more for Our Lord?

We know that those masses cannot be reached.

And we do not let ourselves be destroyed either by those unconscious masses.

We learned that, even if people destroy you, even if you do so much, you keep having to return to the normal human again, and then you are good enough.

Then you already do far too much.

Is it true?

Or is it harsh again?

Gandhi said, when he came ‘beyond the coffin’: ‘For goodness sake, what did I interfere in?’

He could have done it differently.

And he did not see that way, that possibility.

Then he asks a human being, from the first sphere: may I refuse food in order to reach those masses?

Then that first sphere says to Gandhi: why would you let yourself perish for those unconscious masses, after all, people still do not understand now what you want.

And then added to that: why do you want to destroy your own life?

He destroyed himself.

He was, if he had still had the time to live and he had experienced that same treatment, then he would have passed over into his treatment.

You probably know: he still passed over too soon.

Gandhi could have lived for another fifteen years.

He could have done a lot of good, beautiful things, but differently.

Do you see?

The universe, the divine core in him, the spheres have respect for those deeds.

But it is also a pity; now the human being starts to neglect himself.

And this was neglect.

This was conscious destruction with a will, with a force.

And Christ, the universe never forces.

You can never ever achieve something by force.

It is up to you what you think of me.

And even if you say: this is beautiful, or, this is destruction, we accept nothing, neither the good, nor the wrong.

Isn’t it simple?

We do not have any trouble either.

(To the hall): Which of you?

(Lady in the hall): ‘Master Zelanus, can you also tell me something about that divine division?

Did that happen suddenly, or is that, did that take long?

I mean: we talked about that this week, why the people differ such a great deal from each other, by what means that divine division was there, and there were no longer similar ...’

You mean, when the moon began?

(Lady in the hall): ‘Yes ...’

That was divine division.

Or should we go back even further, to the begin stage?

(Lady in the hall): ‘Well, that is not necessary.’

When ...

So for creation everything was already feeling and consciousness.

There were no visible forms, they were not there yet.

But for that creation everything was finished.

So the human being asks: when I am in the Divine All, will I see God then?

Will I see Christ on the other side?

You will not see Him.

You will not see any God in the Divine All, because you are that yourself, I told you.

But it began on the moon.

In the middle.

You know how big the moon is?

The moon divided itself.

When you ...

It can be calculated how many sparks the moon gave birth to as people, that can be calculated.

Because the universes were filled.

And if you take the feeling of human being in your hands, as a macrocosmic attunement, then you place the moon here on your hands, and there the universe, and then you can feel how heavy the moon weighs, and then you will know at the same time how many pounds, kilos of people are present there, when this divides itself.

All the universes were filled.

But in the beginning stage of the moon, you could have laid the moon, you could have laid that working, that power, on your hand, closed it, and you would have had the moon as working in your hands.

But the moon is a macrocosmic body and divided itself by means of myriad sparks.

You can now go and talk for millions of years about millions of sparks, then you will still not have made it, there are so many people.

They were the first people.

But it took millions of years before the moon had divided itself completely.

So there are people who are ahead of me, and who are ahead of you by millions of ages.

So you can no longer make that calculation for your people.

And now you get seven different grades of consciousness here in society.

And they are seven different infinities and worlds of depth; the human being is so deep, and one human being is so far away from the other human being.

So it could be that I am ahead of you and another by ten million years.

And during those ten million years you have perhaps mastered five grams of conscious pure spiritual feeling, because that other feeling, which has attunement to society, to devastation and destruction, no longer has any meaning.

And you can reflect and think in this way.

And then you have one ...

If you meet one human being amongst ten million it is perhaps possible that you meet your own life of feeling, your grade of attunement, it is so awe-inspiring when you meet a human being from your own grade.

But they are only a few million people in the hundred million grades and laws.

It is already awe-inspiring that human beings understand each other so well in this society.

You hear nothing else but devastation and destruction.

And mankind is, lives in a chaos.

And we say: how wonderfully it is going, how advanced the human being already is.

And that is true.

You almost stand, you already stand before the kingdom of God.

There are a few factors, characters, traits, as people, who are still not willing.

But when that is over, you will stand irrevocably before the kingdom of God, and you will experience it.

Because the peoples of the earth – just read ‘The Peoples of the Earth’, the book – are busy laying those foundations.

That finally came that far during those hundreds of millions of years.

And then the human being says ...

After all, the human being does not look back, does he?

The human being does not know that he has experienced two million lives, only for the earth.

What do you master now in this life?

That you are here, proves that you possess feeling and consciousness, and yearn too.

You already are, you already live in the first sphere.

Soon we will be able to speak with you, talk, explain it to you.

And then you will no longer have any space, but then the whole universe will belong to you.

There will immediately be someone next to you, people will see your aura, and you will ask ...

Just long to die, and you will have the cosmic happiness, if you want to experience this in harmony and love.

If you are free from lies and deception, from every destruction, wrong thought, then you will irrevocably have happiness.

And anyone who does not want that, will have to begin with that.

We have the material goodness, don’t we?

But you must possess the spiritual goodness, harmony, being one; and then not one wrong thought will enter you, because that will no longer be there.

Your life of feeling will now find attunement to harmony.

You will receive everything in harmony.

And then the master or the mistress, your sister, can go with you.

Then you can make the trip to the earth for the first time, and then through the universe, first your dying, and then your previous lives.

And then she will tell you who you are and who she is, your mother, your father from ten lives ago for this life will probably stand next to you.

Who is it?

You always have someone ‘beyond the coffin’ who expects you, because you have known and had millions of fathers, mothers.

And now you are a child again, you become a child, you become a universal child.

You will feel, this earthly life means nothing with regard to the other side.

When you speak about happiness, we run away.

When you speak about happiness there, or here, and you are talking about the earth, ‘On the earth I had happiness’; you are not acquainted, you do not even know what happiness is.

What is this?

All the possessions in the world, everything and everything, what is that, is that happiness?

There is no happiness to be experienced here.

You can find that nice and lovely; it is only then when the laws speak to you, when a bird says: follow me, accept me and I will bring you to my attunement, where I was born – a flower, a tree, the universe, the planets – then it becomes happiness.

Then it becomes cosmic being one with all the life of God.

Your personal possessions start to speak to you, and then you go hand in hand further.

Then you will live in spatial happiness for the first time.

And you cannot run out of that for years.

You will succumb under that happiness, because everyone almost succumbs, and so good, under that happiness, because you will weep until your tears run dry from joy and happiness.

Because if you start to listen to that ... if you start to listen to those sounds, then you will want to be free from the earth.

The human being has still not seen and not experienced the other side, but if you have experienced that, then you will close yourself off to wrong acting and thinking.

And harsh things, snapping and snarling, it is the most horrible thing which the universe can experience because of you.

If you feel the silence and the harmony, and you reach being one with a star, with the night, with the moon, with the sun, with Jupiter, Venus, and they tell you how they originated, then you will have arrived in your cosmic kingdom.

And then you will have a key for everywhere, which will not pass through, but which will say ‘click’, and then you will step into a new world.

And the orchids will be singing to you everywhere.

Just leave it, don’t you think?

Just stop.

(To the hall): Which of you?

You would like that.

(To the hall): Which of you?

Yes.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘When someone, what they call dies, for example, a family member, whom people have loved a lot, then we may not mourn continually or be sad about that, may be?

Then we keep him captive to a certain extent, don’t we?’

Why would you mourn, if you know that that person is alive?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘No, but it is true, what I am asking there?’

Yes, indeed.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Well.

And then I wanted to ask, why should we be constantly reminded of Christ on the cross, on which many things are depicted?

I do not think that is a pleasant memory.’

No.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘What Christ suffered on the cross.’

Yes.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘And is continually held before our eyes.’

Yes, that is poverty.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘I do not think that is a nice memory.

Why must that cross always be there?

I cannot really agree with that.’

With who?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Perhaps you would be better to explain that to me, but, that is not a nice memory.

I prefer to think differently about it.’

Did you not hear me clearly say recently that that is the chamber of sorrow of the Catholic Church?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Perhaps.

I was not at every meeting.’

You were here one evening, then we were talking about Bach.

Bach said: ‘What did they do to my art, they are doing nothing else but moaning.’

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Yes, I find that ...’

Can you feel this?

You must now see the Christ, that the human being murdered the Christ.

And now you see everything differently.

You do not need to moan for the Christ, but the human being must moan for himself.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Yes, but we are continually ... with that awful memory ...’

Never here.

A sphere cannot do that.

You do not hear from us that you must be nailed to the cross.

Did you not listen to what I said?

Gandhi already did wrong by hitting himself for mankind.

Why did he do that?

No God wants that.

Christ did not want that either, on the contrary, people destroyed Him consciously.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Yes, I am not saying that Christ wanted that.

I am asking why must we always see that cross depicted?

That is not a nice memory, that we must think of His suffering, what He suffered there.’

That is very good, yes.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘I mean that.’

You cannot ignore that.

Now you must start to see the Christ with divine love and justice with regard to this society.

And now you must keep on admiring that image.

Golgotha, precisely Golgotha.

Then you will finally know how it must be done.

And that you know that.

Do you know that?

Do you already know that, how it must be done?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘How it must be done?’

Mankind still does not know that.

And it is only then when mankind knows that, that Golgotha will dissolve completely, completely.

Also the cross of Christ.

Then you must have some patience.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Yes, but should we constantly be reminded of His suffering?’

Yes, not of that suffering.

You are reminded ...

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘I am reminded precisely of that.’

This is why I tell you: you are reminded – you are not listening – of: do not do it like that, but do it in love.

That is the place, the image which you keep on meeting, and that will remain on earth until mankind has made amends.

Because mankind murdered Christ.

And do you just want to ignore that?

You must see it like this, that this is the image for the whole of mankind, and then you will see it differently, anyway.

And then you will not be able to say: if only it was gone.

Millions of people still need that image, in order to learn: we should not have done that.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Yes, but those millions of people who see that cross there, they interpret that very differently.

They stand there mourning as it were: “How awful, isn’t it?”’

That is the Catholic Church.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘And I mean that now, why must that cross be shown constantly.

Leave out that cross, I mean that.’

Then they could, if they got rid of that cross now, along with Christ and Golgotha, then they would be free of it, and they would learn nothing more.

You do not need to do that for Christ.

But it is still urgently necessary that mankind sees what enormous killings took place amongst the people.

And then Christ’s deed.

Do you just wish to ignore that?

No?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘I do, yes.’

You can do that for yourself, if you know those laws, if you say: yes, we consciously murdered Him there.

Everyone.

If you just think wrongly about the human being, about the universe, God and nature, and whatever, then you hang Him on the cross again.

Do you see?

And then it is different, and it is still necessary that the human being is confronted with his deed, in order to remind him of that destruction.

Otherwise the world would not and mankind would not make progress, and after all this still remains a faith.

You cannot deny the people that.

But the Catholic Church, Protestantism, and Luther, and all the dogmatic institutions made a pity out of that, do you see?

And that is bad.

And just throw that overboard.

Do you understand it now?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Yes.’

Now get the core out of that for yourself and say: I have nothing more to do with that now, I no longer want to see that.

No.

See that other Christ.

We do not want anything to do with that cross either.

But this is still the possession of the masses, mankind.

Mankind must go through Golgotha.

Christ did not ask for that.

So you absorb every footstep in you spiritually.

And then you see the other Christ, after all, don’t you?

Why did people murder the Christ?

Why?

The highest consciousness, the most loving personality which has lived on earth was Christ, and people killed Him.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘People probably did not understand Him.’

Not understand?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘They probably did not understand Him.’

No, they were wild.

Mankind was very wild.

Understand, that is a thousand times higher.

If you (not) understand a human being, then you still do not murder the human being.

You see, that is the lower consciousness.

And that consciousness still has to get that grasp.

Even if the Catholic Church makes everything out of that, even people say: the Christ elevated us by means of His death and gave His life.

Yes, the Catholic Church would like that.

You must earn that.

If you just remember and understand that. They murdered Him.

But all of us, if we just do wrong, then we already sow evil.

And sooner or later it is a mass feeling, and then people are stoned because of it.

Did you not know that?

Is it good now?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Yes.’

Thank you.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘May I ask something?’

Yes, indeed.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Someone who has passed over, at least everyone who has passed over, can everyone from the sphere, or from the spiritual life, see in the material?

See us?’

Yes, indeed.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Everyone?’

Not everyone.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Oh, that is my question exactly.’

When you ...

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Or must you also be clairvoyant for that?’

You are completely clairvoyant on the other side.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Oh.’

You see through all the material.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Then would, so would we then ... ’

But a lower grade ...

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘ ... be able to see in the material?’

...so now it will come.

Have you read ‘A View into the Hereafter’?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘No, I have not read that yet.’

They are lying there.

Three books.

If you live in a darkness ...

You can learn so much, but you do not read.

If you live in a darkness, therefore in a being unconscious, you are unconscious for other worlds, how do you wish to see those worlds then?

If you put, place the child before ‘The Night Watch’ by Rembrandt, and you say and you explain to that child: ‘Look, our Rembrandt made that’, will you get an answer then?

Does that child see ‘The Night Watch’ and all those beautiful works of art, if it is two years old?

The human being is like that.

So you stand before something, you go there and you see nothing.

And if you have darkness, how do you wish to see then?

And darkness is unconsciousness, you do not have any light, you feel around, you really collide with walls if you live in those lower grades and return to earth.

People should ...

You are blind, spiritually blind there.

If you want to experience the higher, you are spiritually blind.

That is clear, isn’t it?

The Catholic Church is still spiritually blind, Protestantism is spiritually blind.

The human being who loathes and throws this away, they are spiritually blind.

You have to experience the same world ‘beyond the coffin’.

And do you want to return to the earth?

You no longer see the higher being as feeling.

You walk through him just like that.

You do not feel ...

You probably feel something.

If those people have one character trait which you possess, then you will feel: hey, I believe that I can feel people here in this environment.

But you walk through them like that, you go through them.

Read ‘A View into the Hereafter.’

We have written three books for that.

The hells, the hells again, then the spheres, first seen outside of the hells, then one with those hells, and then from the spiritual sphere.

Those books are lying there.

(To the hall): Which of you?

(Lady in the hall): ‘Master Zelanus, it is perhaps a bit difficult to say it exactly as I feel it, but I think that you will understand it when I tell you: but you come here, and we also have the books, in order to see our lights shining here.

But you just said something – that is my fault, not yours - ...’

What, my fault?

(Lady in the hall): ‘ ...but I felt: well, then you are on your way in the darkness.

Because you just talked about it: if you are materially good for someone now on earth, then spiritual goodness must also be behind that.

But then you think at a certain moment, if, for example, I give this woman material carry-on, how can I decide for myself that there is no vanity from myself, flattery etcetera behind that?

You will know that immediately.

If you do good materially, that comes from your personality, that already has a grade of love, and love is light.

So what you do ...

But you can now also, even if people deceive you, even if people say: you should not have done that, it is a crime to help such people ...

That is also true, those laws exist.

But your deed continues as feeling to be a part of your personality ‘beyond the coffin’.

You have that irrevocably.

(Lady in the hall): ‘Yes, you were also going to speak about the purpose of the appendix.’

What good is the purpose of the appendix to you, which dissolves and has no meaning?

That question was asked several times for fun.

That appendix is the final part of a group, of a system, for the new universe.

And there is no more to it.

So that little part is actually already a feeler, such as you send out your thoughts and feelings for the spirit.

You keep having, the human being, every human being has new feelers, which reach further.

People call that sensitivity.

And in this way every system has another part – every body part – a little part for the new stage.

And that part, of that appendix, starts to work and will work as a new system for the body on the fourth cosmic grade.

That is another planetary system.

And you can already feel, you can now already start to see how rarefied that is becoming.

That is becoming spiritualized materialization and now that builds itself up, now that grows.

You must now think separately from your own body, from this state.

So you come to the fourth cosmic grade again, you first go through seven spheres, you get a universe again, we call that the fourth cosmic grade.

And then you get the fifth.

This universe is called on the other side and for God, the creator: the third cosmic grade.

And that is subdivided by moon, Mars, earth.

So you got the third grade by means of different planets.

And the fourth cosmic grade, that is a unity.

And now every body part has a new stage and attunement.

So in that cell there, which has a higher becoming conscious ... that body, that material, has a new growth, and your appendix is also a part of that.

Anything else?

(Lady in the hall): ‘Yes, I also wanted to ask: do female attuned souls also work in the dark spheres?’

In the darkness?

Yes, indeed, you can soon descend.

(Lady in the hall): ‘Oh.’

But do you not understand that?

You have that here too.

Just go to the children of the Salvation Army.

Those children do good work.

And when they soon ...

You will all come to stand before that when you soon come ‘beyond the coffin’, and become awake.

You can experience a lot for the first time.

Then you get ...

And then you can go on for millions of years to enjoy, to gain wisdom.

And, but ...

You will learn a lot during that time, but you will not get any change if you do not reach out your hands.

Then your consciousness will therefore always remain the same.

You master the wisdom, but you can nevertheless experience the dark sphere.

Because also those dark beings there in those hells, in those unconscious worlds, those high ones there in those hells know a lot.

They understand all the occult laws, they know the darkness, they know the earth, they know the universe, and they go far and deep, and have the power over mankind, over evil.

If you speak about evil amongst the peoples, then those spirits, those souls are now busy attacking the good, until the good has completely conquered the evil.

So you can soon descend.

But then we will have to have you under our hands for twenty-five years first, in order to be able to cope with that, in order to learn to go out of evil, and to still be in it.

So you become angry, and you are not it.

And you are part of such a personality.

For example, you can, you can develop the most beautiful and the most wonderful yourself if you descend into the mental institutions, for example, in order to protect a human being from general deterioration.

Then lock yourself up in an insane person for some twenty years.

And those people exist.

Millions of people are in the mental institutions, and help there.

And in that darkness.

Just read ‘A View into the Hereafter’ again.

And then you can know too, and you will know, how difficult that is to elevate the human being to the good.

Because the human being has to conquer himself completely.

Anything else?

(Lady in the hall): ‘Yes, can someone go insane as a result of a shock?’

What did you say?

(Lady in the hall): ‘Can someone go insane as a result of a shock?’

The shock can only heal you.

Of course there are also laws of feeling, how you, and when you can use that shock.

What is the working of the shock?

Do you know that?

(Lady in the hall): ‘No.’

Very simple.

Because of that shock, because of that power, people push the nervous system to working, upwards.

So your own material, physical concentration is weakened, and because of that shock, because of that working, because of that diathermy, people elevate the systems and now the personality as feeling must go along: back to the day consciousness.

There is no more to it.

Very simple.

And now of course you get to measure the power of the personality with regard to the heart, the central nervous system, brain; and now one gets too much, what the other gets too little of.

Because ...

The doctors do not know that yet.

Why not?

And they cannot know that either, because after all, they cannot gauge the power of feeling of the organism.

Yes, a moment ago around the pulse, in order to measure the heart beat.

But in the deep core they cannot measure the physical systems.

And now it still remains a question of searching.

Your shock is that far.

That shock is on the other side, that instrument, is balanced out with regard to the cosmos.

The instrument here is still far too coarse.

When that becomes more rarefied later, by means of the atomic energy and different technical wonders, you will reach the life of feeling, and it is only then those technical wonders will have an enormous meaning.

That is therefore becoming rarefied, spiritualization, growth of that instrument with regard to the material tissues.

Anything else?

(To the hall): Which of you?

(Lady in the hall): ‘I wanted to ask something: someone who passed over insane, can he still see the manifestation of someone because of the protection?’

Yes, indeed.

Look, now we have ...

Not if you are spiritually insane.

Have you known anyone who was spiritually insane?

Yes, you call that spiritual, but it can have a material cause.

So you get a disorder in the brain which restricts the spirit from thinking normally, in day consciousness.

That is clear, isn’t it?

But if it is now a spiritual insanity, then it is unconsciousness.

That human being, that personality needs a thousand years in order to awaken; and then it will not be possible.

But if it is a material disorder, then you will become free from that disorder ‘beyond the coffin’, and then you can send out and think again, and then you can manifest yourself.

That is clear, isn’t it?

And then it will be possible.

But you will feel, if I cannot think things through ...

You have insanity because of a tumour in the brain.

They are not insane people, but now they are attacked by the astral world, because those people already experience helplessness in the organism.

They feel a powerlessness.

They cannot think things through.

The normal does not reach the eyes, because there is a restraint within this body.

And now that is seen from the Other Side, and now they attack those people.

And you also get the physical disorders, usually of a sexual nature.

Now the messing about comes.

You will feel, they are powerless people in the hands of conscious astral beings.

And they want to take possession of that body, they want to be one, because that body gives warmth, gives feeling, and they look again through the eyes.

And then you get ...

For example, now you can ...

Those doctors, those psychologists do not look through that now.

But now you can immediately notice and see by one direct action whether that life is already under astral, spiritual influence, already directly from the action.

From their speaking, from their actions, we know immediately: here is astral influence.

Why?

You yourself do not know those feelings for the earth.

But the doctor now looks at the body, he does not know those laws, does not know that action –because we know that action; now we see him materialized – and that doctor thinks: that is the human being himself.

And now you get even more chaos.

It becomes difficult.

Now you get thousands of grades of people, types of thoughts which occur, which are materialized by a conscious astral personality.

If that human being here on earth is now susceptible to that, to this, to this, that and the other, then you will feel, then that human being will get influence, because of every wrong thought.

And because of every character trait I am open to that character trait, and that is the human being.

So I draw because of a character trait, a wrong character trait, I already draw the whole personality to me.

If we are here on earth ...

André is always in danger with this, this work.

If I was to think wrongly now at the moment, he would not get me out of this organism.

So then there would follow ...

If you read ‘Jeus I’, then you will feel, then ...

If that child ...

If a child starts to see, then there is actually already insanity for you, and great danger.

Now, we paint, we write, we healed, we see, we hear, but every seeing and every hearing, every action in the occult area takes you through insanity.

Am I not normal?

I am now explaining laws to you.

Now you should see what we have achieved up until now by means of a human being.

And that is all from us; you cannot draw that out of that world yourself, you will not come so far, so deep.

But every action ...

If the core in André was not pure then we would not have begun with it; because sooner or later he would burst and succumb, and then the mental institution would be open.

So you must have an enormous spatial conscious personality in order to really be able to serve for masters.

A painting can knock you to insanity, a poem, a scratch, it goes so deep.

And if you then ... books and books and books and books ...

You will feel, this must be pure.

Why?

Because this life of feeling came from a source where there was already certainty, or master Alcar could not have begun with it.

Moses could not have experienced this, because he would have succumbed.

And then you can get to know all your insane people, your psychopaths.

Read ‘Diseases of the Soul’; unfortunately it is sold out.

Have you read it, ‘Diseases of the Soul as seen from the Other Side’?

You can borrow it here from the library.

(To the man who takes care of the library): Do you still have some books?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Yes, master.’

You can still read them there.

Then you will get to know those insane people and then you will learn a lot, because then you will look through the insane person, the psychopath, and you will look at the universe, you will go back again, you will just dash back and forth, and you will get growth.

You will get to know the human being, even if the human being is sick and unconscious.

And then be grateful yourself that you can read that and can remain conscious, because it says: you are already that far.

Because how many millions of people do not become afraid if they just hear: this has to do with the Grim Reaper, with ‘the coffin’.

And ‘the coffin’ is not there, the Grim Reaper is not there; you fly out of that, you get wings, or you are disturbed on the way.

Anything else?

Is there anything else?

(To someone in the hall): Yes.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Master Zelanus, what is the cause that one human being is under anaesthetic within a few counts, while the other sometimes has to get a dose twice?’

That human being works against it out of fear.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Can that also be unconscious fear?’

Or ...

You have unconscious fear and conscious fear, yes, indeed.

Now you also get once more: how conscious is the body?

Because the body now also has an own consciousness.

Can you feel this?

When you ...

I will now present you with a question: where does the highest, strongest consciousness live?

When does the human being have the highest, the strongest consciousness for the body, when?

Because you enter a state where your natural consciousness as a human being weakens, and then you get a very different life of feeling.

Where is that?

(Lady in the hall says something.)

What did you say?

(Lady in the hall says): ‘When you pass over.

No.

Do you not know it?

It is not so simple either.

Then you must have the whole universe in you, and then you can immediately give an answer.

You can ask me a question.

You should just try asking a hundred thousand questions, and all different.

Then you will immediately get the answer because I do not need to think.

If you lose motherhood and you become a father, then you no longer have any paternal consciousness, and then you are under anaesthetic in only a few seconds.

But the stronger your creating consciousness becomes, the more severely you thwart it; if you want to thwart it, out of fear.

If you surrender completely, then it is easy again for the doctor, the anaesthetist, and you go along with him.

But you lose your natural physical working consciousness, of course, because every tissue has a hundred percent consciousness as creating and giving birth power.

And if you are out of the maternal power, you lack the creating, and the other way round.

Do you understand this?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Yes, master Zelanus.

But now in my case, because it is actually about that.

I was under anaesthetic last year.’

Yes.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘And I wanted to go, I wanted to be under anaesthetic; and I was, in less than ten counts I had sunk away.’

You wanted to go.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘I definitely wanted to go.

And now you have also people ...

And you managed it?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Yes.’

And now you also have people, precisely because they want it, it does not work.

And why not?

Because now you thwart it, because you want it.

Because your will is spiritual and the anaesthetic is material.

Now you thwart it.

You must not want; you must surrender passively, and then you will get the immaculate, pure anaesthetic.

There are people amongst you, amongst me, who say: ‘I had to have an operation, and now I want to experience the transition; now I can perhaps look ‘beyond the coffin’, or disembody.’

If you only you had not longed for that now and you had surrendered absolutely calmly as you surrender in your sleep, then it would perhaps have happened.

And now your will, your will, your will, your will was standing  before the door, before the letting go, and that now restricts you.

Can you feel the difference?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘But what is the cause then that it worked for me?’

What did you say?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘What is the cause then that I sunk away in a few counts?’

Because you have the feeling, and because you have read the books, you know the laws.

So that wisdom already brought you to that becoming free, to that sleep.

When you get more and more space, consciousness, you will also be able to take care of your sleep.

So you were, by means of what you learned, able to surrender yourself and that happened immediately, by means of the doctor’s help.

Anything else?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘May I just also ask: in which grade of sleep is the anaesthetic situated?’

Different again.

The normal depth for sleep and the anaesthetic is between the third and the fourth grade.

There are now also three grades of sleep.

But why do you reach, do you experience – I am asking that to the followers who have already been coming here for years – why can you not experience the fifth?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘The fifth is the trance state.’

No.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘The disembodying.’

The disembodying, yes.

No, that is death.

So when you come above death, then you are also dead here.

So you must remain below that threshold of the fifth grade, of the actual death.

And why do you not get that anaesthetic?

Why not?

Then you can see how simple everything is again.

Why not?

Why do you not get that deep sleep now?

(Lady in the hall): ‘Because I have to live.’

There you are, child.

Otherwise that doctor will no longer need to cut you and operate on you, because then you will already have operated on yourself.

You are already dead, you enter ‘the coffin’ just like that.

So he must make sure that your heart beats and that you stay alive.

So you get the anaesthetic just above the third grade, above that threshold, and then you walk of your own accord to the fourth, and then you will not feel anything anymore and yet you can experience and feel everything.

But you will feel, you will understand how clearly those physical laws work and how simple it is, won’t you?

But for the doctor it is a study of seven years.

Bring me to the operation and let me look you in the eye, and then I will tell you immediately, when you are still conscious, how deep people can put you under anaesthetic.

And then I will tell the doctor, the surgeon, also your professor: you will experience that and that during the cutting.

You see, that can be seen in your light.

Because consciousness is the possession, the blood circulation, isn’t it?

The more consciousness you have, the more your blood flows, your body works.

So you get to see the physical power by means of the consciousness of the human being, and that is the light in your eyes.

That is a big question.

The doctor must first start to look and start to examine you before he really operates on you.

Because the normal, good surgeon must do that.

And then he starts to measure the strength of the body.

People take your pulse.

And you get the anaesthetic, according to the beat, don’t you?

Isn’t it clear?

Did you have anything else?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Yes, master Zelanus, I still do not understand one thing.

The normal anaesthetic is between the third and fourth grade, you say, of sleep.

But if I experience the normal sleep, that is the fourth grade; and if you were to jab me with a sharp object, I will waken up.’

Yes.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘And that does not happen between the third and the fourth grade.’

No.

But why not?

If you ...

Look, you are now making a mess of your sleep and the enforced compulsory anaesthetic.

So your systems now live under force, people have disengaged the systems, and if you are asleep, there will be nothing wrong with you.

You react immediately.

Even when people come just like that.

Because you are awake, and there you are asleep.

So if you sleep, you do not sleep.

You say that you sleep, but you do not sleep.

You are talking about sleep, but if you sleep, you do not sleep; your spirit is awake.

And now you are materially and also physically asleep, because of the anaesthetic.

Can you feel the great difference?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Yes.’

Thank you.

(To the hall): Anything else?

(Lady in the hall): ‘When someone is apparently dead ...’

Yes.

(Lady in the hall): ‘ ... and he is buried while he is stiff, do you then experience the same thing as a suicide?’

No, because that is not possible, after all.

(Lady in the hall): ‘I thought that if you were apparently dead, then it was also spiritual ...’

If you are apparently dead, then you are still alive, aren’t you?

Then you cannot experience any rotting, can you?

(Lady in the hall): ‘No, but then ...’

No, because he has been buried then.’

And then he starts to ...

(Lady in the hall): ‘Then he will die.’

Then he will, then he will just die, honest, honest death, honest, now ... (laughter)

Then he will die honestly.

(Lady in the hall): ‘No, but if it is not his time yet?’

If it is not his time yet?

(Lady in the hall): ‘Yes.

Let’s just say, he could live for another fifteen years.’

So you mean to say: that apparent death is an illness?

(Lady in the hall): ‘Yes, I don’t know, actually.

What is apparent death actually?

By what means do you become apparently dead?’

That is a material disorder.

No more than that.

So it is an illness.

And that illness brings the human being into ‘the coffin’.

But an illness.

So you can conquer that illness and you can also die because of that.

(Lady in the hall): ‘Oh yes, now I understand it.’

And now ...

But that is an injustice, do you see?

There is something not right.

Because the normal death dies, is death.

And the apparent death has nothing to do with death.

(Lady in the hall): ‘No.’

So you can now be apparently dead because of a disorder.

It is a sort of calcification, but that lies deeply spiritually and has a spiritual influence.

The real, people still have to establish the pure apparent death.

Because the spirit must absorb and deal with it with regard to the body, and it is a material disorder, because the spirit is awake and the body no longer works.

So now the human being gets an illness, it is not called cancer now, but apparent death, and is exactly the same thing.

You can ...

Cancer is a dying too soon on earth, but now because of your family.

I call that karma.

But your father and your mother, your own family, are to blame that you pass over too soon, because people began there with the building up for cancer.

You all pass over too soon.

If you die too soon because of the diseases, cancer, serious diseases, fatal diseases, cores, then you are in a karmic death and not a natural death.

And you can ask once more, of course: what is natural now and what is unnatural?

And what is truth and what is untruth?

And what is just and what is injustice?

You see, now thousands of problems come because of the Grim Reaper alone; and he does not exist, he stands next to you.

Yes, books, books, books, books, books.

Did you have anything else ?

(Lady in the hall): ‘Master Zelanus.’

Yes.

(Lady in the hall): ‘If the fifth grade of sleep is death, what is then the sixth grade and what is the seventh grade?’

Then I would advise you to read ‘Spiritual Gifts’.

Because it is a great deal, which I cannot explain at once.

You get the pure laws analyzed there, up to the magician who lets himself be buried.

If I want to explain all of that so that it is of some use to you, I will need at least two, three hours for that.

It goes much deeper.

I can explain it to you in two minutes, but that will be no use to you, after all. But it is in ‘Spiritual Gifts.’

So, if I see any opportunity that we ...

We wrote those books for you, now you are asking about them precisely.

Now take your time in the evening, great, let your spouse take care of you, and you will read those laws.

(To the hall): Can I tell you anything else?

(Lady in the hall): ‘Yes, master Zelanus, it is from the jungle time to now that we women give birth to children, which happens with pain.’

Yes.

(Lady in the hall): ‘Now I read a medical article two weeks ago and that English doctor said in that, that the women could give birth soon without pain, if they wanted that.

Because, this man says, fear plays a large part for women.

Because, he says, they then put different muscle groups in operation which should not be put in operation.

For example, he says, the pains which are the dilation contractions, and the birth contractions, which therefore prepare the muscle systems for the whole birth, are thwarted by the fear of the mothers, so those mothers thwart those muscle groups, those severe pains come because of that.

That is what he said.’

That is probably a doctor of twenty-four years old.

Look, on one point, but he does not know where – those laws lived – he is right.

But still, in a lesser state, the mother has always felt and experienced the growth of the bone system, since the origin of creation, the growth of the bone system.

Those pains, those contractions were always there.

And if they were not there, then that can be seen now.

Where can we experience that?

Because nothing has changed in nature.

Go outside in the spring and you attune yourself to the moaning of a bud, that growing, that giving birth.

Those tissues must grow.

That is not actually pain.

If you want to experience that spiritually, spatially, then you can dissolve that instantly.

But it is not old age which speaks there, that is a doctor of twenty-four, twenty-five years old.

And if that man is older, then the mother will soon tell him what it is about.

Because what he is saying is not possible.

Fear?

There are thousands of mothers who have everything and everything to spare in order to receive a child, and to accept the child and the contractions and the pains with happiness, with joy.

Is there fear now?

No.

(Lady in the hall): ‘But he has that, he proved that experimentally by giving lectures to mothers-to-be, and out of the hundred mothers there were eighty who had little pain.’

Yes.

Now you can, of course ...

If you surrender this.

You must ...

Surrender in the very first place.

But now the body must be normal.

But you have too narrow mothers, too spacious mothers, don’t you?

So you now get to see the seven grades for the normal maternal giving birth for the first time.

When is a mother completely naturally ready to give birth?

One mother out of hundreds.

Because those bodies have seven grades for motherhood.

Those bodies were built small, built large and spacious, have the space, have the consciousness, the pelvis has the consciousness in order to give birth.

And there are also pelvises which do not yet possess the consciousness, so that becomes ripping apart.

The growing, that is not even there.

There are bodies which would give birth for the first time at twenty-five, twenty-six, or thirty years of age, and those mothers give birth at twenty, twenty-one, twenty-two, twenty-three.

So that body is still not even – even if it is possible – adult, naturally adult.

And now the doctor has the healthy mother, the mother with the happy nature, the mother with the normal, natural organism in order to give birth.

You see, that is all possible, that all speaks now.

But the actual, natural core is painful, because every spark in nature undergoes that growth, and that is a painful feeling.

Because ...

Now you can go even deeper.

And that can be seen again, in nature it can be experienced and seen materially, but it can also be seen spiritually.

What does a gram of feeling of consciousness cost you in suffering and sorrow for your love?

If you want to possess a gram of feeling of consciousness as love, do you know how much suffering and trouble you have to experience and to accept because of that?

So the spiritual growth, becomes material being one for giving birth and creation.

You can write a book about that again and deny him everything and say to him: ‘Sir, what do you know about that mother?

Is that mother ready?

And this little mother?’

‘Yes.’

‘So.

Can she do that?’

Now you can also ...

Now we first go to the natural laws and now we come to the self-suggestion.

So that mother forces herself into that and that state, and now she has the feeling, she has known lives, reincarnation, was probably in temples, and now she can anaesthetize herself; that is also a part of it.

So how many possibilities do we come across already for giving birth alone?

But that every mother in the future will no longer have any pain ...

Then it will not be fun anymore.

(laughter in the hall) Because the joy, the joy of undergoing that growth, is the ripping apart of the macrocosmos.

Yes, it is difficult.

What did Our Lord say?

If you enter paradise ...

That doctor must send you back to the paradise of the bible, because his answer lies there.

Because God said in that: ‘And now you will give birth to children in sorrow.’

That was a curse, do you see?

And when that doctor stands there, we do not need to do anything else, because then he will hurl, I write in ‘Jeus II’, then he will hurl the Old Testament upside down and then the Spheres of Light will be able to breathe again.

And Christ will say: ‘Finally we are that far.’

Because of that doctor.

(To the hall): One more question.

Another question.

What are you looking at?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Master Zelanus?’

Am I a master?

(To the hall): Which of you?

I will probably get a fright that the people call me master.

Did I earn it?

(People in the hall react.)

Hendrik or Piet?

Which of you?

I am close to you this evening.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Is it possible that we, as we are sitting here, gained more knowledge of the laws of the universe in our previous lives than is now revealed in this life?’

Say it again.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Is it possible that we gained more knowledge in our previous lives, than is now revealed in this life?’

You have gained more in this life than in millions of lives before this.

In one year, because of five books, which you are now reading, you can gain more than millions of lives before this.

You must turn it around precisely.

Because ...

Why?

You have the feeling, but you did not know it, for that matter, did you?

If you know it, you are also busy.

But in a short time, in a few years you can master millions of wisdom in feeling, in power, within a few years, if you want.

One wrong deed, an action, a snarl, a snap, a harsh word already hit you back out of that possession; you know that too.

So you can earn it if you do not do any wrong things.

But in this life, this is your consciousness; because from your question and your feeling, I know, I am acquainted with your consciousness.

You did not have that over there.

Because you go increasingly further, don’t you?

Is that clear?

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘Yes, master Zelanus.

I have one other question: imagine that we were a fakir in our previous lives, or one of our previous lives ... ’

Yes.

(Gentleman in the hall): ‘ ... then we have gained more knowledge of the occult laws than we now actually know, than is now actually revealed, haven’t we?’

Yes, but then you have material and not spirit.

When you arrive in the East ...

You have heard of Ramakrishna.

A fakir came to him, and says: ‘Master,’ Ramakrishna catches the darkness, ‘will I give you light?’

And light immediately shone from his hands.

And then Ramakrishna says, and the other side says that: ‘Give me a year and I will teach you not to do it; because you are standing still.’

You see, you must lose that again.

Because that does not give you consciousness.

On the contrary, you now no longer become free from your kidney, from your nervous system, that holds you captive.

So you must go back that same way in order to master the spiritual wisdom of it; and that goes to the personality.

It is also clear again?

(To the hall): Another question?

(Lady in the hall): ‘Master Zelanus, you say one wrong word places us back again, but ...’

Yes.

(Lady in the hall): ‘ ... is that not the supreme priest of Isis who actually had the great wings, not like Venry, but he was full of hatred then, how was that possible then?

I probably understand it the wrong way, but, I cannot work it out.’

Yes, now you must not compare that time and here.

We now speak from the spiritual conscious source.

But that book was written for that time.

So it deals with that and that form of character and feelings.

Is it clear?

But when we now start to speak from the other side, from the first sphere ...

Those priests were still not in the first sphere.

Dectar was just a little mite, a little child, and yet strong in the occult laws.

They knew a lot, they could think, they could heal.

But what does it mean?

That was not possession, that was not spiritual possession.

But in order to arm ourselves against wrong thoughts, that is now the consciousness and the possession of the human being, and you can master that by means of the occult laws.

But what is now an occult law?

And now I come back to you again, to this time.

Be good, be loving, be gentle, have a kind look in your eyes.

And when the human being greets you, say: ‘Good day, madam’, ‘Good day, sir’.

Isn’t it true?

They are children.

Do not look strangely at the people.

You do not need to carry the people, that sphere says, your space says.

But this life belongs to you.

And there we only served ourselves.

So that study was not aimed at growth of spirit, but growth of knowledge, knowledge.

But that is not spiritual consciousness.

Spiritual consciousness means: you master that world and that space with one thought, one deed.

What did we do there?

How could we master those laws?

We studied and learned for ourselves.

I thank you for your interest, my children.

I am going.